Diet: Low Carb and Ultra Cycling

Discussion in 'The Bike Rack (bring your own coffee)' started by ratz, Apr 10, 2016.

  1. LarryOz

    LarryOz Zen MBB Master

    I have not tried this.
    I personally do not think anything but carbs in liquid form will give your muscles the fastest and most usable energy if you are racing or riding at the highest effort "above endurance" levels.
    This would be things like Time Trials rides/races or record attempts of greater than 90 minutes.
    From what I have read and experienced your body still only has the capacity of metabolizing about 300 calories per hour regardless of your activity level.
    Breaking down your fat for the energy your muscles need is still relatively slow, but if you are riding at a lower endurance level, then that is pretty much all you body needs.
    The goal for long distance time trialing (for me anyway) of stuff like 100 miles or longer, is to drink liquid fuel (mostly carbs - but a good mix of other) so that the body has to use the least amount of energy to make that fuel usable to you for your effort.
    super slim and CruzLike like this.
  2. DavidCH

    DavidCH In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity

    I made a bulletproof coffee this morning... blurry eyed I mistook the ginger for canela oddly enough it tastes refreshing with a bite and it's probably better for me.
    Tigerpaw likes this.
  3. ed72

    ed72 Member

    Test..........I get "The content you wish to post is not allowed" error
  4. ed72

    ed72 Member

    I know this is an old thread, I am a Bent Newbie, and I only read the first 4-5 pages. Just adding my two cents. I was fat adapted for 2 years and although not nowhere in the league athletically of many here, I had great results as an old Randonneur and also did the xyz cross country Bike Race, which is when I fell off the LCHF diet due to the only food available was garbage. I need to get back LCHF.

    I an xyz with strips to measure my ketones in the morning and later in the day. I also used a power meter and xyz lactate meter and also glucose strips. Usually well less than 50g carbs per day initially and always in ketosis.

    What I learned over the 2 years was that once adapted, my VT1 power was actually higher in output but my heart rate was lower than when I was on a more sugar based diet. VT2 did not really change....other than a bit when peaking. My fitness signature changed (I used xyz1, xyz2 and xyz3). I could put out (for me) a greater percentage of my modest FTP at a lower heart rate and with much less fatigue that I attribute to fewer ROS of fat oxidation versus glycogen. My muscles did not get sore.....I was like a the xyz4 Bunny . I wonder is other low carbers found less soreness after say 20-30 hours on the bike. It is like I went from a gas engine to turbo diesel.

    What did this look like performance wise?

    Let's say I was doing a 400K or 600K riding with a stronger rider on a DF or a Velomobile (usually I rode Solo). At the beginning, we on DF bikes might be doing the flats at 22-23 mph and 220-240 watts pulling and 160-170 sitting in. This is not hard for an hour or three but it would be a little harder for me than my companion because 240 is Tempo for me. What we all know happens is power drops at the event gets longer. Controlling or moderating that decline is key. My companion's power would drop faster and would have trouble holding my wheel. I saw this time and time again. I would be asked to slow down so they could hold my wheel. This is diet related in my mind. XYZ has efficiency factors and decoupling indices. My heart rate would actually decrease and put out more power.....never figured that one out....wierd. My Brevet times went down. Under 24 hours for 600k and under 14 hours for 400K. Hours less time. I could do a 400k hard and feel completely fresh. Like drive 10 hours home fresh.

    I also learned that although bonking was impossible (plenty of ketones to keep the brain happy), higher power output does suffer if glycogen is gone and you do go a little slower but not a ton slower. I used to go on 200-300km rides without breakfast or food during the ride to try to cheaply estimate my RER although the price of having it done at Dr. 's former lab at UConn is not too expensive. I then experimented with how much "sugar" I could ingest and when and what types during a ride to avoid an insulin spike. This took me 6 months to figure out. I also experimented with ketone salts. What I found is my coffee with coconut oil before a ride was usually fine and then about 1 hour into a ride, I would consume around 100-150 calories per hour of a unique homebrew powder mix. I really never needed to eat anything for "short" 200K rides.

    LFHC keto fat adaptation really paid off for me during Paris Brest Paris (1230 km Grande Randonnee). I rode with the fast(er) kids but made the mistake believing the controls would have food. We were so fast that the controls were just setting up and the other riders were largely supported unlike me who rode with no support. They got food from their crew. I got water from the fountain in the street. I rode the first 447 Km with around 13,000 feet of climbing in about 15 hours on two bottles with my fuel mix, one banana, and water. My muscles were out of glycogen at Tintineac (maybe at 365 km) at like 3 am and it was 39F. If I was not fat adapted, I NEVER would have made the next hilly 80 km in that cold. Nonetheless, there is a power price to pay and I knew I was in trouble. The anaerobic pathways were not accessible to jam over the short steep leg busters. The critical decision? What to do at sunrise when getting to Loudeac (447km into it)? I would have the hardest climbing 100 miles to Brest and the same 100 miles right back to Loudeac. I was pretty messed up energy wise despite being clear headed. I knew I had to replenish glycogen. I also knew to avoid an insulin spike. Lots of cold rice custard pudding (fat and resistent starch). Two huge bowls of hot whole milk chocolate. Some egg thing. I might even have had wheat but cannot remember. I pumped 1500-2000 Kcals in. Got back on the bike and began hammering the big climb out of there. Why? To temper or avoid the insulin spike. Certainly this remedy goes against dogma, but I recovered from what could have ended my ride (woulda been a serious bonk) to a pretty quick time.

    The other strangeness was the improved efficiency. Calories per mile and efficiency factors in xyz. My VT1 heart rate is now seemingly permanently low now. VT1 is like Zone 2 pace. Before my 2 year Keto journey, I would make 190-195 watts at 120-125 BPM (lactate level determined). After adaptation, it was 220-225 watts at 103-108 BPM (again lactate). Now on a Bent, my power numbers are different but I still put out good aerobic power at low heart rates. I guess I'm a diesel.

    Sorry rambling and grammar/spelling errors and disjointedness. I could not post because content was not allowed error and I deleted a bunch of stuff hoping it would post but made a mess of it all.
    Don1 and castlerobber like this.
  5. DavidCH

    DavidCH In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity

    I have just been reading an interesting article in a triathlon magazine about organic silicon being a compliment in your diet to get over all those aches and pains. Anyone tried this? It sounds like an April fall joke.
  6. Mathew Fy

    Mathew Fy Well-Known Member

    I’ve seen these “organic silica” supplements advertised and they appear to significantly improve the wealth of the sellers. This Diatomaceous Earth has no known health benefits taken as a supplement.

    There are studies, however. When it is used as a constructive matrix that provides drugs and biologically active intermediates in a controlled delivery. Possible uses may include orthopedic surgery.
    super slim likes this.
  7. The Brook

    The Brook New Member

    Hi all,

    I'm 62 years old and my girlfriend and I started the Keto diet on Tuesday, so far, so good! I've kept my carb intake at under 50 MG/day, and was able to totally avoid sugar.

    Today, I went on a 1 hour ride where I kept my heart rate between 125-130 bpm, and I was surprised at the energy I had.
    I would have thought that my glucose levels should be very low after almost 3 days of low carbs, but my energy level was up.

    Could I have already started burning ketones after such a short time, or was my body finding a hidden store of glucose?

    Thanks for any insights.

  8. DavidCH

    DavidCH In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity

    You should be going cold turkey in a week ... bread for me was the real addiction. 3 weeks without it and you will be clean.
  9. The Brook

    The Brook New Member

    Well, after today's ride, I'm starting to see some benefits.
    The scale shows 3 pounds removed in 4 days, but it is the effort I was able to put out, easily the best workout of this year.
    My heart rate was continuously in the 135-145 range, my legs felt very strong all the way through my 1 hour workout. This loop I ride usually takes me about 8 minutes longer on my previous best days, and up to 15 minutes longer when my legs feel dead.

    I don't know why I feel so good so soon, but I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth!

    castlerobber likes this.
  10. NeaL

    NeaL Active Member

    I'm dabbling in keto at the moment. When cooking just for myself it's not a problem but looking up recipes... I have two kids who won't eat meat.
    Phasing out the carb options a few things at a time, though.

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