S40 transformed into F40?

Discussion in 'Road Series (S1.x, S2.x, S30, S40)' started by Charles.Plager, Jun 4, 2017.

  1. DavidJL

    DavidJL Well-Known Member

    This reminds me of a Trailmate trike I had years ago, for a short time. This basic design is still being made today. But the S-trike allows better gearing.
  2. Apollo

    Apollo Well-Known Member

    Eric, is your velomobile the original Strada or Strada DF? If it's the original, there is a significant difference in performance when compared to the fastest commercially produced velos available now. Didn't a velomobile racer in a DF win this year's Sebring, and by a big margin? I recall this being posted on BROL.

    With a capable and experienced pilot, a fast velomobile is faster than just about anything on most routes barring those with a lot of climbing or traffic. Also, weather plays a role. Contrary to what some velo owners state, regions with excessive heat or long summers are not ideal for enclosed HPVs, and I believe that performance is degraded compared to unenclosed or unfaired (at front) bikes or trikes. Ignoring long climbs and heat, the right velomobile and rider is unmatched...

  3. Eric Winn

    Eric Winn Zen MBB Master

    I have a Strada. The "Strada DF" nomenclature never really made it to production and it became just the "DF" after the creator - Daniel Fenn. The DF is a carbon fiber design with far fewer metal bits and more carbon. It is lighter than a Strada and much stiffer. A Milan SL is very fast and quite light for a velo. Frankly, I'd like to see the elevation and grade info for that Milan SL video before getting too excited about the overall performance. Even my Strada will coast at some of those speeds with some of the grades going down in that video. When I first bought my Strada and rode it home 85 miles (136.79 km), toward the end there was a mild down grade (just a few degrees) that I easily hit 35 mph (56.3 kph) and I was getting tired since this was my very first ride in a velo.

    When it is really hot out, I'm more comfortable in my Strada with my Flevo roof than an open bike. Yes, you get hot and sweat like crazy but keeping the sun off makes a remarkable difference. Key is to keep moving. Gets a bit too sweltering at really low speeds or stopped.

    At the 33rd Annual Michigan HPV Association Rally this past weekend we had a Quattrovelo, DF, and Milan actually racing and an Alleweder that was present. I didn't feel like toting my Strada so I raced my Vendetta.

    Results here. Click on the Faired Hour Time Trial and you'll see Michael in his Milan averaged 26.049 mph and was only bested by the strongest streamliners (two wheels, e.g. they can corner faster than a trike). In that same section you'll see the winner was Denis Greek in his streamliner averaging 30.299 mph. Now if you click over to the un-faired 1 hour TT you'll see Dennis Greek also won that one with a 25.688 mph average. Dennis is hard to beat. Larry came up here and raced with us and can testify to how accomplished Dennis is.

    Michael Hinterseher, #112 was in the Milan (he also owns a Quattrovelo)
    Ted Peer, #142 was in the DF
    Linnae Hinterseher, #107 was in the Quattrovelo (Linnae is Michael's wife, they each own a Quattrovelo but Michael was racing his Milan)

    Here is Michael's 1 hour TT info on Strada in his Milan. The top left corner in the map is this annoying little hill that seems puny the first time or two but gets really annoying the more often you loop back around to it. If you look closely Michael took the first lap too fast and at the bottom right at the end of the longer straightway he told me he elected to cut through the sand and grass to scrub off speed because he was going too fast. That is where Strada is showing him hitting brief peak speeds like that 46.8 mph (75.3 kph). I'm not sure if that 67.1 mph (107.9 kph) is legit or an equipment blip of some sort. Of course he slows down a good bit every time he hits that dad gum little hill. :rolleyes:

    super slim and tiltmaniac like this.
  4. Charles.Plager

    Charles.Plager Recumbent Quant

    I would think that an F40 (like Cruzbike) would give a velo a run for it's money, particularly when there is climbing and traffic. :)
  5. Eric Winn

    Eric Winn Zen MBB Master

    Of course. I think I said that earlier. You have the aero advantage of the velomobile but without the significant weight penalty but a lot still depends on the quality of the rider.

    There have been some F40s racing at the MHPVA and other locations in the past. You can look at the HPRA Track Records and see there are 7 references to an F40. Different types of races so you need to take care what you are comparing but here are a few samples from that page. It is more useful to go look at these on the referenced page and compare them to other types of bikes in the same events.
    • 2004, Tyger Johnson, velodrome 50 lap race: 28.62 mph (46.06 kph) compare to 2009, same location, Dennis Grelk in a Barracuda streamliner: 32.87 mph (52.90 kph)
    • 2004, Tyger Johnson, 10 Lap RR-Half Mile: 24.25 mph (39.03 kph)
    • 2012, Wally Kiehler, Road Race short loop (21 laps): 21.33 mph (34.33 kph)
    • 2001, Tyger Johnson, 1 Kilo SS TT: 30.05 mph (48.06 kph)
    Still no real challenge to Dennis Grelk. Note Dennis holds 42 HPRA Track Records. You might recognize some other names there like Bryan Ball, John Schlitter, Jacquie Hafner (now Jacquie Schlitter), Thom Ollinger, Charlie Ollinger and many others.

    And of course on the World Recumbent Racing Association records page you'll see 5 records for Maria Parker, 1 record for Larry Oslund, 1 record for Will Parker and a bunch of other talented folk.

    The Fastest Human Powered Lists is fun to play with. There are some mind boggling numbers there - try selecting fastest hour and show highest speed for each rider.

    Check out number 42 and 43 in that list (as of this post):
    42 40.328 mph (64.902 kph) Ymte Sijbrandij quest
    43 40.277 mph (64.819 kph) Theo van Andel Quest

    There are 6 Quest velomobiles in that list with Ymte and Theo being the fastest.

    Charles.Plager and Mathew Fy like this.
  6. Mixerman

    Mixerman Member

    The F40 is silly fast. My main issue with it was it felt more like sailing than cycling at times. I had to use techniques like using my elbow to change the shape of the spandex fairing and lean into the wind. Even with no wind, the cars and trucks riding by me would pull and suck me as they drove by. And downhill 40+ mph is terrifying as the fabric flaps violently and stability is compromised with any gust or change of wind direction. A heavier rider may have an easier time with it, I weigh 145 lbs. Still fun as hell!!!

    Climbing in the F-40 is not too bad, basically like a 37 lb P-38, but I wouldn't wanna climb any mountains with it, especially in any heat. It can feel like a sauna in there!

    Half of the owners manual involves learning how to deal with the wind, it's no joke, I wouldn't ride it above 15 mph wind. It really is a fun machine tho.
    I would also love to see someone put a full fairing on a S40, just stay safe my friends
    super slim likes this.
  7. tiltmaniac

    tiltmaniac Guru

    One of my other bikes is a P-38. I keep wondering if I should get the fairing retrofitted...
    (but I keep spending my time making my S30 better ;) )
    super slim likes this.
  8. Charles.Plager

    Charles.Plager Recumbent Quant

    Get something faired!

Share This Page